On Peter and Paul in Rome, 1 Clement 5:1 reads: “Consider the noble examples of our own generation. I'll just take the first stab at this. On Peter and Paul in Rome, Ignatius writes in his Epistle to the Romans 4:3 : “Not as Peter and Paul did, do I command you. And I've had people admit to me that, I know that if I admit God's real or that the Bible's true that God's going to want to change my sex life or he's going to want to change this or that. This week, we had a very interesting dialogue between a Roman Catholic apologist and a Protestant apologist on the topic of "Sola Scriptura". QUESTION: Depending upon who you ask or who you talk to, you'll find out the Earth is so many years old. And Scripture itself testifies to this, the same Scripture which testifies that Christian truth comes to us in two ways: through Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition (2 Thess 2:15). FACT: Yes they did; and they had good reason to believe this, as evidenced by John 14:16-18 & 26 and 16:12-13: [14:16] “And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Advocate to be with you always, [17] the Spirit of Truth, Whom the world cannot accept, because it neither sees nor knows Him. This is part one of a panel discussion that occurred at an apologetics conference not long ago. You can have conflicts within the Bible. The Gospels were not written down immediately. And he said, As I'm going through this and I'm writing this book and some other stories come to mind and I throw it in there so I go back and I insert these in, he said. Sola scriptura means that Scripture alone is authoritative for the faith and practice of the Christian. MARK MITTELBERG: I should warn you he's written like a three-volume book on this, so how much time do you got? Using the Eucharist as an example, one cannot therefore say that “Tradition” in 2 Thess 2:15 merely refers to a “one-time deliverance of teaching” from Paul to the Corinthians, but is rather an on-going institution, exercised weekly in the Eucharistic celebration itself. Now that is not to say that the story never occurred. Therefore, FACT: These two men (Clement and Ignatius) — who knew the Apostles — taught from both Scripture and from a common oral Tradition: the Tradition referred to by Paul in 2 Thessalonians 2:15. FACT: 1 Timothy 3:15 calls the Church the “pillar and foundation of Truth.” Yet, Scripture alone is never called this; nor is Scripture ever considered authoritative when apart from the Church, which is guided by this same Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1:20-21 & 2:1-3). MIKE LICONA: If you're asking: Do I believe the Bible is divinely inspired? In the first place the early Church did not have a Bible with which to practice sola scriptura. Scripture alone is authoritative in faith and practice. Even if the world, as the video says, is a projection of my brain – that I am all that exists – nevertheless that still cries out for some explanation. The popular press does not understand science and as a result it systematically promotes the sensational, the outrageous, the outlandish because this is what is a headline-grabber. These Biblical truths served as theological pillars that supported the whole of Spurgeon’s ministry. On the Eucharist as Sacrifice, we have Ignatius’ Epistle to the Smyrnaeans 6:2, 7:1 : “Consider how contrary to the mind of God are the heterodox in regard to the grace of God which has come to us. These are if-then statements in the subjunctive mood, not the indicative mood. Do I believe it's without any error? Edward … I was going to ask what your opinions on this particular matter were, and how do you deal with questions about that? If you ask a science teacher, they might say two or three million. Christ, therefore, is from God, and the Apostles are from Christ. FACT: Christ goes on to say how this Spirit of Truth will “remain” with the Church and will “be in” the Church always, guiding it toward all truth. But in fact there are reasons why this is so. Posted by 5 years ago. Ephesians 3:3), since many of the Christian writings excluded from the New Testament canon also contain such references to Divine inspiration (e.g., The Apocalypse of Peter, the Protoevangelium of James, etc). Let’s examine the facts: FACT: There is nothing in Scripture teaching that “Scripture alone” is all-sufficient for the Christian Faith. And they go, Sure. I've actually asked people, Can I just ask you honestly – is there some reason you don't want this to be true or is there something in your life you're afraid you'd have to give up or change if it is true? The Earth is not flat. For to the high priest (e.g. So I'd invite you just to look at that and ponder what I say there and see if it doesn't remove the inconsistency. FACT: There is also no statement within any of these New Testament books claiming that these books are Divinely-inspired. A lot of scholars who think that it didn't appear there in John do think that the story is authentic. Corinth itself) until it was excluded from the New Testament in 397 A.D.. They seem self-evidently ludicrous. Sola scriptura is a second-order claim. In principle and practice, divine revelation can be oral as well as written. I give what I think is a good answer to that, and they go to the next thing. I don't want to take our time now going into it, but look at what I've said there and see if it doesn't make sense of this. Here you will find a deep library of writings, videos, podcasts, and more that feature the work of Dr. William Lane Craig. DR. CRAIG: On the website ReasonableFaith.org, Question of the Week number 16[2] addresses this. QUESTION: I guess my follow-up question would be why do these things persist? Now, he says the doctrine of Sola Scriptura is incoherent because it was church tradition that canonized what is actually in Scripture. www.catholic.com Is it reasonable to believe the Christians should rely on the Bible alone as it's sole authority? The Doctrine of Sola Scriptura Did Not Exist Prior to the 14 th Century. There was no New Testament as we understand it today throughout the first century. FACT: Therefore, Christ is promising that the Holy Spirit — “the Spirit of Truth” — will remain not only with the Apostles, but with the entire Church, a Church which will still need to be guided and comforted after the Apostles are gone. I'd say yes. WHAT YOU'LL FIND HERE Welcome to ReasonableFaith.org! [1]           https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bEOjWyrP2U (accessed July 22, 2019). For this reason, therefore, having received perfect foreknowledge, they appointed those who have already been mentioned, and afterwards added the further provision that, if they should die, other approved men should succeed to their ministry.”. MODERATOR: Dr. Craig, did you want to add anything? If you gave sola fide the same treatment you’re giving sola Scriptura, you’d conclude that the Reformers didn’t believe that works had any place in the Christian experience at all. If you read the Bible you might literally take it as six, seven, eight, maybe ten thousand years. But we Protestants recognize Scripture alone as our ultimate rule of faith (the Reformation principle of sola scriptura). They're called counterfactuals because typically what they envision is not factual. [applause]. Just the opposite, in fact. QUESTION: Are there other cases of extra-OT Scriptural Traditions recorded in the NT? Sola Scriptura Debate!! But before I do I would just like to say that, like everything posted on this blog, this is not meant to be an attack towards or some form of hatred towards Protestants. He commanded us to celebrate Sacrifices and services (the Eucharist), and that it should not be thoughtlessly or disorderly (i.e., 1 Corinth 11: 17-34), but at fixed times and hours. It was quasi-clear so I was hoping you would give me an explanation. Common sense suggests that some sort of oral tradition was always needed to accompany the Written Law. Obviously, the author was mistaken, at least about the timing of the Rapture…even after recalculating and predicting a new date several times. So, now we’ve come full circle. The Bible says we should be lovers of truth. It therefore follows that we have a continuation of Christian Tradition: a Tradition which never included a doctrine of Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone). QUESTION: In a way it would be a conflict that would show some sort of error within the way we have the Bible right now. So I, at least, exist. ……Our sin will not be small if we eject from the episcopate those who blamelessly and holily have offered its Sacrifices.”. Sola Scriptura or a three-legged stool? In the course of the dialogue he finally admitted that, yes, I had succeeded in showing that there's no inconsistency between God's being all-loving and all-just and his issuing these commands to annihilate the Canaanites. Prédication sur Romains 13, en la Cathédrale d’Édimbourg, le 19 août 1565 : « En quelques mots, l’apôtre Paul déclare la finalité pour laquelle le glaive est donné aux puissances en disant que c’est “pour… DR. CRAIG: Yeah. June 3, 2016. QUESTION: All of Scripture is God-breathed and there are no errors. They were Apostles, and I am a mere convict.“. What's New. And to follow-up with that, you are starting to hear the stuff about Earth is flat. . As such, it has divine authority. The Bible is complete, authoritative, and true. And rather than going, Oh, OK, that’s really helpful, they realize that's not working so they throw out something else. MIKE LICONA: That's a great question, and the answer is we don't know a whole lot. MODERATOR: God's relationship to time and how that relates to prayer. Sola Scriptura simply means that all truth necessary for our salvation and spiritual life is taught either explicitly or implicitly in Scripture. So one would never be justified in believing such a thing. PROPOSITION: Is Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone) a reasonable method for understanding Christian orthodoxy? Our Mission: Reasonable Faith aims to provide a subreddit which focuses on: * Philosophical and … Press J to jump to the feed. I have a friend who did his PhD – his doctoral research – on this text, and he went into it wanting to show that this was in the original Gospel of John. Since those who have a Sola Scriptura hermeneutic do not accept Tradition and the Magisterium, before it can be shown that the Immaculate Conception, for example, is necessary to be believed, the Catholic must first show why the claims of Catholic authority are reasonable. [laughter]. It's an attempt at having sensationalism. MODERATOR: It sounds like what you are arguing is it seems inconsistent. . Rather, Paul is citing Jewish oral Tradition. But, you know Him because He remains with you and will be in you. Discuss this article here. FACT: Jesus Himself lived by these oral traditions. The question is: Does God know how we would act in any situation in which he might put us? I think that we would never have good reason for believing such a hypothesis. Is it reasonable to believe the Christians should rely on the Bible alone as it’s sole authority? He can know how we would pray whether he's in time or timeless. 1. In our dialogue in Australia, Lawrence Krauss raised this issue. In the Bible we had the stoning of the woman caught in adultery or the attempt they were going to stone that woman caught in adultery. Owing to envy, Paul also obtained the reward of patient endurance, after being seven times thrown into captivity, compelled to flee, and stoned. [16:12] “I have much more to tell you, but you cannot bear it now. Hey! That was really neat. I think Descartes is absolutely right in saying that it's impossible to deny one's own existence because in denying that you exist you affirm that you exist. DR. CRAIG: Have you had a chance to read what I’ve written on this yet? Let’s examine the facts: FACT: There is nothing in Scripture teaching that "Scripture alone" is all-sufficient for the Christian Faith. On the Eucharist as Sacrifice, 1 Clement 44:4 reads: “Since then these things are manifest to us, and we have looked into the depths of the Divine knowledge, we ought to do in order all things which the Master commanded us to perform at appointed times. Sola Scriptura asserts that the Bible can and is to be interpreted through itself, with one area of Scripture being useful for interpreting others. I'm going, You're probably right and I'm pretty sure this is the real issue now, not whether we're some projected experiment from some mind somewhere or whatever their theory was. QUESTION: How is that reflected in the character of God? Maybe it wasn't in the original Gospel of John. If a tradition or practice in our lives contradicts the clear teachings of the Bible, our goal must be to change the tradition to match the Bible's … And he came out saying, I just don't know. Using that sort of knowledge then he can providentially order the world so that your prayers really do make a difference. 11. It’s Kevin Harris, and you are in for a rousing, entertaining, and informative podcast today as Dr. Craig joins a panel discussion with Mike Licona, Mark Mittelberg, and Leighton Flowers who also is moderator of this panel, and just fields a variety of questions like whether the universe is a hologram (maybe it’s just a projection and not really real), how prayer and time work together, and God’s justice. Therefore, we bring even the statements of Ecumenical Councils before the bar of Scripture. If we accept there are some errors in the Bible then how is that authoritative in our lives? Yet, the Book of Exodus itself never names these two magicians, nor does any other book of OT Scripture. MARK MITTELBERG: Exactly. On Apostolic succession, Ignatius’ Epistle to the Smyrnaeans 8:1-2 reads: “You must all follow the bishop as Jesus Christ follows the Father, and the presbytery (priests) as you would the Apostles. Mike, do you want to start by answering that one? No two people agree. (the Septuagint), how much more so could the Catholic Christian bishops at Carthage in 397 A.D. count on the Spirit of Truth! MODERATOR: Let me restate the question to make sure that we're following it. C’est en maniant adroitement cette doctrine que les protestants peuvent systématiquement démonter les dogmes non-bibliques du catholicisme … We just don't know. MODERATOR: Are there others that would like to come forward and ask a question? User account menu. DR. CRAIG: I think that that's philosophically absurd. QUESTION: Yes. I think that prayer changes things. MIKE LICONA: OK, well, that could reflect on the character of God. This principle is largely based on 2 Timothy 3:16, which says, "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness." But at the end of the day we just don't know. I don't know. Therefore, do and observe all the things whatsoever they tell you, but do not follow their example.’ “. Some of them will go with us on that. . MARK MITTELBERG: I would just add to that on a more personal level I think a lot of times it's just people are looking for interesting theories that kind of take you off on rabbit trails of philosophical speculation rather than letting the truth get to them. FACT: Christ calls the Holy Spirit “the Spirit of Truth” (John 14:17, 16:13). QUESTION: I really enjoyed your presentation there, Dr. Craig. He passed away a couple years ago; he was in World War II, a vet. FACT: Three of these oral Traditions documented in 1 Clement are: 1. FACT: Yes it was. Reverence the deacons as you would the command of God. . It's a condition that if it were like this then this is the way it would be. Enjoying this content? I wonder if you have any answer or any thoughts on that. Archived. In other words, if God's outside of time or his relationship to time . FACT: While the “chair of Moses” is an element of ancient Jewish tradition — apparently dating from the time of Moses himself — it is recorded nowhere in the Old Testament Scriptures. . And I cannot imagine what sort of a defeater would fit that condition. Főiskolánk 1999-ben indított teológiai szakfolyóirata a bibliai iratgyűjtemény eszmerendszerének és hatástörténetének bemutatását, az ehhez kapcsolódó kutatások eredményeinek ismertté tételét tekinti küldetésének. FACT: There is also nothing in Scripture determining a Divinely-selected list of inspired books (i.e., the present New Testament canon). If I had not pulled out into traffic, I would not have been hit by the oncoming car. This becomes especially striking when we realize that both St. Paul in 1 Corinthians and St. Clement here in 1 Clement are writing to the same city-church (within 35-40 years of each other); and that both these scriptures were read side-by-side by this church — both being considered Divinely-inspired by the Corinthians for 300 years! FACT: Yes, there are. FACT: Christ does not maintain that a written record is necessary to remind us of His teachings; but rather that the Holy Spirit (Who will “be with you always“) will remind the Church of all that He taught (John 14:26). The Catholic Church’s assumption of supreme authority in Christendom relies heavily on her contention that Christendom needs one…that without a visible, religious establishment divinely mandated to accurately interpret Scripture … I mean, why can't we come up with what the answer is and then be done with it? …. Is the Bible the only infallible rule of faith for the Church? Can I just be really honest with you? I think it's baloney but it seems to be an idea that some people are embracing just because it's an explanation without being an explanation. It is not a claim that all truth of every kind is found in Scripture. Aside from the Old Testament Scriptures, the Jews also lived by a number of ancient oral traditions (many of which will eventually be recorded in the Jewish Talmud). ¶ Le réformateur calviniste John Knox (1514-1572) sur l’application de la doctrine biblique et protestante du Sola Scriptura aux autorités civiles. I know as I share my faith with people often they will raise what seems like a good objection, and I give what I think seems like a good answer. I guess the better way to phrase it would be: what is your definition of Sola Scriptura? Not in the sense that it changes God's mind, but in the sense that God knew whether we would pray or not, and if we would pray he may have providentially decided to do certain things that he would not have done had he known we would not pray. It seems as our scientific knowledge and understanding is increasing, it seems like scientists are twisting themselves more and more to find explanations beyond what you're saying. FACT: There is nothing in Scripture suggesting that a time will come when this dual expression of Christian truth (Scripture and oral Tradition) will come to an end. QUESTION: This is probably for Mike and probably for Bill, too. DR. CRAIG: Let me say this. Also, in his Epistle to the Philadelphians 3:2-4:1, which says: “Take care, then who belong to God and to Jesus Christ – they are with the bishop. DR. CRAIG: No, no. After preaching both in the east and west, he gained the illustrious reputation due to his faith, having taught righteousness to the whole world, and come to the extreme limit of the west, and suffered martyrdom under the prefects.”. He will not speak on His own, but He will speak what He hears, and I will declare to you things that are to come. As difficult a reality as it may be for some to face, this foundational doctrine of Protestantism did not originate until the 14 th century and did not become widespread until the 16h century – a far, far cry time-wise from the teachings of Jesus Christ and His Apostles. So when it says so-and-so begat so-and-so, it doesn't necessarily mean that was father and son. Catholic Church placed church tradition on equal ground with Scripture, and the Protestant reformers affirmed sola – … I really like the aspect of the fine-tuning. So that's how I would answer that. 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